Everything In Between

The brutally honest, first-person account of Meitar Moscovitz's life.

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Disagreeing with “How to Disagree”

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This is cross-posted from my scratchpad, Maybe Days.

A visual representation of Paul Graham’s Hierarchy of Disagreement, also called the Argument Pyramid. Each layer in the pyramid can also be referred to as a numbered Disagreement Hierarchy level. For example, name-calling is sometimes referred to as DH1, while refutation is sometimes referred to as DH6.

In his words and from his essay, How to Disagree:

The web is turning writing into a conversation. Twenty years ago, writers wrote and readers read. The web lets readers respond, and increasingly they do—in comment threads, on forums, and in their own blog posts.

Many who respond to something disagree with it. That’s to be expected. Agreeing tends to motivate people less than disagreeing. And when you agree there’s less to say. You could expand on something the author said, but he has probably already explored the most interesting implications. When you disagree you’re entering territory he may not have explored.

The result is there’s a lot more disagreeing going on, especially measured by the word. That doesn’t mean people are getting angrier. The structural change in the way we communicate is enough to account for it. But though it’s not anger that’s driving the increase in disagreement, there’s a danger that the increase in disagreement will make people angrier. Particularly online, where it’s easy to say things you’d never say face to face.

If we’re all going to be disagreeing more, we should be careful to do it well. What does it mean to disagree well? Most readers can tell the difference between mere name-calling and a carefully reasoned refutation, but I think it would help to put names on the intermediate stages. So here’s an attempt at a disagreement hierarchy

See also: solving disputes.

Not to be confused with arguments that rest on the shoulders of other arguments, ala, an Argument Pyramid where an argument is an explanation, reasoning, rational, or story.

While I agree with the majority of Graham’s points, I do disagree with one of his main rationales (i.e., arguments). Graham says:

[W]hile DH levels don’t set a lower bound on the convincingness of a reply, they do set an upper bound. A DH6 response might be unconvincing, but a DH2 or lower response is always unconvincing.

If I’m reading Graham correctly, he’s saying that disagreeing by using ad-hominem and name-calling tactics are “always unconvincing.” However, then he says:

The most obvious advantage of classifying the forms of disagreement is that it will help people to evaluate what they read. In particular, it will help them to see through intellectually dishonest arguments. An eloquent speaker or writer can give the impression of vanquishing an opponent merely by using forceful words. In fact that is probably the defining quality of a demagogue.

I’m left wondering: If an eloquent speaker or writer does successfully “give the impression of vanquishing an opponent merely by using forceful words,” does this leave the opponent or, often more importantly, the unnamed third party in any dispute (the observer) convinced of their argument? Often, at least in my experience, the answer is yes. In fact, the widespread “successes” of demagogues are a testament that it’s not always necessary to be correct—that is, to be truthful or, in Graham’s words, intellectually honest—in one’s assertions to either realize a particular intent or to sway people’s minds, but rather one merely be right—that is, to be perceived as the winner of the dispute.

I both personally appreciate and sympathize with Graham’s clear and noble intent to bring more happiness to more people. I even agree that using higher DH levels will generally achieve more happiness during dispute resolution, but I remain unconvinced that higher DH levels are always more convincing (or, “useful,” or “effective”) than lower ones. This is not to discount the usefulness of understanding DH levels. After all, one must know the rule to break it well.

Perhaps the most useful example of situations where lower DH levels are, potentially, more useful is applicable to leadership. For example, David Logan speaks of 5 “tribal” stages of leadership. Stage 1 tribes are, in his words, “a group where people systematically sever relationships from functional tribes, and then pool together with people who think like they do.” People in a “stage 1 tribe” may be gang members, prison inmates, or anyone else who, effectively, believes that “life sucks.” Logan describes “tribes” from stage 1 all the way up through stage 5. A stage 3 tribe, he explains, “is the one that hits closest to home for many of us because it’s in stage 3 that many of us move. And we park. And we stay. Stage 3 says, ‘I’m great and you’re not.’”

Indeed, Logan’s not just talking about some nebulous notion of community, he’s talking about the way people move between communities, and, moreover, how they talk to each other when they do that—he’s talking about communication. Now, it should almost go without saying that convincing people of something is simply one part of communication, and if one is to communicate convincingly with others, one ought know how others communicate. Moreover, one ought identify these others explicitly: opponent(s), comrade(s), and observer(s).

How do each of these groups communicate? In what “tribal stages” are these three groups? In my experience, and in many disputes, one is attempting to convince one’s observers rather than one’s opponents, and the more observers there are—such as is afforded by the Internet’s development, as Graham states—the less likely it is that all of these observers are in the same tribal stage.

So Graham is correct when he says that “you find there is a lot more meanness down in DH1 than up in DH6.” But if we are willing to accept Logan’s conclusion that “leaders need to be able to talk at all the levels so that [one] can touch every person in society,” then Graham is incorrect when he asserts that “[y]ou don’t have to be mean when you have a real point to make. In fact, you don’t want to. If you have something real to say, being mean just gets in the way.”

I think, actually, it’s quite the contrary. Sometimes, being “mean” is the point. Moreover, depending on the context and, yes, perhaps counterintuitively, that’s not necessarily a bad thing. As Walt Whitman once famously said, “Do I contradict myself? Very well then: I contradict myself. (I am large, I contain multitudes.)”

For antagonism, dearest loves, is not in fact the inverse of intimacy.

Written by Meitar

April 20th, 2011 at 9:00 pm

What if the Ten Commandments were affirmative instead of negative?

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Of the Ten Commandments, only 3 are phrased in the affirmative. The other 7 are phrased as negatives. Why? Doesn’t that seem kind of oppressive to anyone else?

Here’s the Ten Commandments as listed on Wikipedia:

  1. I am the Lord your God
  2. You shall not make for yourself an idol
  3. You shall not make wrongful use of the name of your God
  4. Remember the Sabbath and keep it holy
  5. Honor your father and mother
  6. You shall not murder
  7. You shall not commit adultery
  8. You shall not steal
  9. You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor
  10. You shall not covet your neighbor’s wife

Well, it certainly sounds like Insert-Your-Favorite-Deity is having a bit of a power trip. Let’s take a closer look at these commandments, but this time let’s phrase them all in the affirmative.

  1. I am the Lord your God
  2. You shall identify falsehoods and treat them as such
  3. You shall respect the power of words, names, and language
  4. Remember the Sabbath and keep it holy
  5. Honor your father and mother
  6. You shall let other living beings live
  7. You shall honor the relationship contracts that you enter and those of others
  8. You shall honor the property of others
  9. You shall uphold truth as you have seen it
  10. You shall strive for your own happiness

Doesn’t that sound infinitely better already? Interestingly, I feel that this rephrasing not only covers more ground (e.g., “You shall honor the property of others” turns “You shall not steal” into protections against stealing and vandalism), but it’s also a lot more inclusive of diversity.

Now let’s take this one step further and rephrase even the ones that were originally affirmative so that they not only reflect positive ideals, but also engender self-empowerment in the reader. Now my ten commandments read as follows:

  1. I am lord over my own body and mind
  2. I identify falsehoods and treat them as such
  3. My power comes from words, names, and language
  4. I honor my memories and choose my traditions
  5. I honor my chosen family
  6. I protect and create free life
  7. I demand respect for the relationship contracts I enter and grant respect to those of others
  8. I gift wealth to others
  9. I uphold my own convictions
  10. I spread joy

I wonder what kind of world we would live in today if this list had been the Ten Commandments so fervently adhered to. Since nothing in life is unchangeable, I’m going to start believing that these self-empowering words are the Ten Commandments for me.

Written by Meitar

March 13th, 2010 at 4:23 pm

Stop Encouraging Fear

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If you are wondering why it seems that everyone today is so defensive, you need look no further than your own television set, or newspaper. Bruce Schneier says it best: stop the war on different. And, going hand-in-hand with that slogan: refuse to be terrorized.

Written by Meitar

November 1st, 2007 at 12:59 pm

Your opinion is probably bullshit

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See all On Bullshit videos.

Written by Meitar

October 7th, 2007 at 9:02 pm

My tax dollars hard at…play?

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The government’s admission:

Millions of dollars that are supposed to fight terror are actually going to the very worst kind of pork barrel programs. Meanwhile, many real homeland security needs – like those in New York City – remain unmet.

Unfortuantely, this is usually what happens in any large organization. Money is budgeted, then siphoned off for supposedly useful purposes. The problem is that the people doing the grant-giving for certain purposes don’t know the first thing about what is needed to fulfill that need. The result is the worst of human nature: people apply for “free money” in the name of the grant-giver’s ideals.

See the report (PDF).

Written by Meitar

March 2nd, 2007 at 3:23 pm

The Ultimate Meta Web Site?

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My inbox chimed with a very interesting notification today. Apparently, maymay.net has made it into AbousUs.org’s database. For thsoe of you who have never heard of AboutUs, don’t worry, neither did I until today.

AboutUs claims to be

a wiki whose goal is to create a free and valuable Internet resource containing information both about websites and other related data. The site was pre-populated with information about many different websites and thousands of updates are now being made by people each day.

This strikes me as an interesting (and vague) concept, not because of its novelty (after all, Yahoo! did very much the same thing before even Google got into the information harvesting frenzy) but because of its methodology. The site bears an obvious resemblance to Wikipedia in more ways that one. It runs the same software (MediaWiki), is a wiki, and openly calls for help from the global community to keep its information accurate and growing.

But really, how meta can we usefully get, right? How long do you think it’ll take before a web site proclaiming to be a valuable resource for information on web site directories pops up?

Written by Meitar

December 26th, 2006 at 9:23 pm

Journaling Jury Duty

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I spent both yesterday (Wednesday) and today’s morning (Thursday) sequestered at jury duty at the New York Supreme Courthouse downtown. It was not fun, but it was a novel experience and by that virtue alone I managed to have a good time.

Trial by Journal

I was called once, sent to the jury box and spoke a little bit about myself, answering questions from a sheet of paper in a narrative form. Ultimately, I was excused from the trial and that was the furthest towards being a juror I got. I spoke to several other people, all of them women and all of the older than I am, during my time at the courthouse. One of the women I spoke with, a graduate student studying neuroscience, was selected for the same case that I was excused for.

A few folks have asked me why I wasn’t selected. I can only say that I don’t really know, and I’m not really concerned with the matter. If I had to hazard a guess, however, I’d say that it’s because very few people know what to make of me when they hear me present about myself.

Case in point, during the voir dire (French for “see and say,” the part of juror selection where you speak a bit about yourself), plenty of folks turned their heads at me in surprise. First, when I mentioned that I have completed neither college nor high school, again when I said I am barely making a living doing web consultancy work, building, maintaining, and developing web sites for clients, and finally when I mentioned that My brother was mugged once and had his glasses stolen.

The truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth. And yes, we were under oath. The only semi-direct question I was ever asked was by the (very creepy looking) defense attorney who said, Mr. Moscovitz, you have no prior jury experience, and I answered a very plain, No, I have not.

So why didn’t they pick me? Who the hell knows. They didn’t pick a bunch of other people either, so perhaps they didn’t like my hair for all I know.

What I do know is that I am supposed to be compensated for my time with eighty dollars from the State of New York sometime in the next eight to twelve weeks. Even better, I spent the vast majority of my time reading my tech books and working on my web site. If I could keep getting paid forty dollars a day to do that, I’d volunteer for jury service! (Um, provided I don’t actually get selected to sit on a case.)

Some New Furniture

Anyway, that is that, as they say, and it was certainly an educational experience. On Wednesday afternoon, after we were released for the day I went to see my father who offered to buy me some cheap cabinets. I have two of them now, each with four shelves, one white and one black, leaning against the wall waiting to be assembled.

He also bought me a demented laundry hamper (its legs are twisted out of shape and for all I know it’s almost broken already) and a toaster oven. I’m looking forward to utilizing the toaster oven, but I don’t know exactly what for yet. First comes groceries, then comes toasteries, then comes the maymay with the dinner…cabbage?

Random Thoughts and Impulsive Musings

Tired

Bah, I’m tired. I’m pretty much convinced I have DSPS (an acronym for Delayed Sleep Phase Syndrome), a condition which basically fucks with your ability to get to sleep at any reasonable hour, despite exhaustion. This is very different from insomnia, which never really rung true for me.

Supporting a Friend

Another noteworthy point to mention is that an acquaitance from the Bipolar Disorder Meetup Group (who is quickly becoming a friend) called me Wednesday night at around nine o’clock. I could instantly tell that something was wrong. She told me she needed to talk to another bipolar, someone who won’t think I’m just totally crazy, y’know and I happily obliged.

We spoke for a half hour about mood swings and triggers and other people’s perceptions and ways to deal with it all. In fact, I wish I would have recorded that conversation because it would have made a great podcast. Which reminds me, I should learn more about podcasting.

More Website Donations

On another front, my father donated an incredible fifty dollars to my web site fund through my PayPal donation form. He said, part jokingly, that he was so embarassed not to have been the first contributor that he put in extra cash. (See how great your donation was, Chris?)

Snail-Junk-Mail

Last and probably least, I keep getting weird mail addresse to various different people in my inbox. It started off a week after I moved in here with a single, small letter. Then there were two letters, then three and a magazine, and it has continued to grow until now I’m getting a full-sized cardboard box that I’m somewhat leery of touching.

Which also reminds me: Find out how to forward mail. I don’t want to keep getting this stuff because I keep hoping it’s for me and then it’s not. The only mail I get are bills, which is more than a little depressing.

Photos of The Gates and More

And on that note here are a few recent photos fresh off the compact flash card.

  • View of the snow-covered park from my window sill.
  • Christo's 'The Gates' in Central Park on a sunny afternoon.
  • My brother, Shir, in front of one of The Gates.
  • Carrots being prepped for juicing in my sink.

Written by Meitar

March 18th, 2005 at 2:31 am

Paranormality Going Normal

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Ever since I heard of someone trying to sell a Virgin Mary and Baby Jesus potato chip on E-bay (which I wanted to link to but can’t seem to find the page), I’ve been hearing about a bunch of various copy cats. For instance, today Blondzila has discovered someone selling John Kerry reincarnated as a corn flake and there have been recent reports of Virgin Mary appearing on a grilled cheese sandwhich. This is yet more evidence that humans are excellent meaning-making machines.

Written by Meitar

February 28th, 2005 at 9:05 pm

Posted in Randomness & Rants

Late-Night Randomness

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Randomness:

  • College is a business, not an educational institution.
  • Scientists love porn.
  • According to one legend, Apple Computers is named Apple Computers because: It was the favorite fruit of founder Steve Jobs. He was three months late in filing a name for the business, and he threatened to call his company Apple Computers if the other colleagues didn’t suggest a better name by 5 o’clock.

    Update: Tom of AtomicBird.com has just informed me of another story about the origins of the Apple Computer name and logo:

    It comes from the legend about how Isaac Newton discovered gravity. The legend says that Newton was sitting under an apple tree, and an apple fell on his head. This caused Newton to think about why it fell, and why things should fall down and not some other way, and eventually led to his theory of gravity.

    When Apple computer was started, they hoped that it would be not just an electronics company but a force for inspiration that might change the world. They adopted “apple” as a reference to the apple that fell on Isaac Newton, suggestign that their computers could serve to inspire people in the same way that the apple inspired Newton. At first, the company logo was not the rainbow-colored Apple, but was instead a picture of someone sitting under a tree, with an apple in the tree looking like it was about to fall on their head. You can find this logo online, for example, right here.

    Very interesting.

  • Noah Wyle confirms the legitimacy of RSS.

O. K.

Written by Meitar

December 6th, 2004 at 2:14 am

Why You Should Always Back Up and Never Go to Best Buy

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My girlfriend owns a $2,000+ Sony Vaio laptop computer bought directly from Sony with a two-year warranty. For precisely two years and one month it worked without a problem. She kept it (mostly) updated with Windows Update, downloaded new virus defs regularly and kept it pretty clean.

Then one day, as she was showing a friend some photos she ran Windows Update in the background. When Windows Update had finished, it requested a restart. Normal enough….

But Windows XP never finished loading. After 10 minutes, it was still running that ugly green progress bar across the screen. So we did a hard reset and waited. BIOS starts, and suddenly we get our message from hell: “Windows did not start up properly on its last attempt. Revert to the last known good configuration. We are sorry for the inconvenience” or something like that. Fine, we can be good Micro$oft $uckers and follow directions.

No good, it hangs at the progress bar again. Okay, hard-reset, error message, this time we try normal mode. No good, okay, hard-reset, error message, let’s try safe mode. No good, okay, hard-reset, error message, let’s try command prompt.

Written by Meitar

October 24th, 2004 at 8:15 am